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Author |
TOPIC: I need opinions on league bats. NSA vs. ASA!!!!!! |
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| DReid
July 12, 2006
8:52:17 PM
Entry #: 1556880
| After this past weekend, I have had a lot of people talk to me about revisiting going to the NSA/USSSA bat list that I posted about last year. A ton of people seem to be in support of that now. I've been talking to managers and am seriously considering it. I'm wanting to open what up to what people think about this. Please respond on this thread or give me a ring. If we did something, we would probably start it with the fall league.
Dan
967-4711
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| Lynx
July 13, 2006
10:51:24 AM
Entry #: 1557873
| Dan,
It sounds like a good idea to me. How many different bats are we talking about and what if any opinion do people have on the safety of players/pitchers with the change to NSA/USSSA approved bats?
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| DReid
July 13, 2006
12:46:17 PM
Entry #: 1558132
| It pretty much comes out to any bat that is currently made. The only bats outlawed in NSA are the original Synergy (which was just about as hot as the Ultra's were), Louisville Genesis, the Ultra's and the original Freak (the 100mph Freak, which is legal in ASA. That list is the same for USSSA except that the original Freak is legal. I'm pretty sure that it only has to do with the fact that Miken didn't get a contract approved with the NSA for that bat to be legal. A money thing.
The thing is that the bats are not that much hotter. They are no where near the Ultra's, but are a little more hotter than the ASA bats. If I were to going to rank the bats, I'd go:
Ultra
Original Freak
NSA/USSSA
ASA
I don't think that the NSA bats are as hot as the original Freak, but are better than the ASA bats we are swinging. So I don't think safety is anymore a concern than it is now with the Freak.
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| Lynx
July 13, 2006
3:04:51 PM
Entry #: 1558499
| Based on the info given, I would vote in favor of making the change.
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| Yoast22
July 14, 2006
1:22:13 PM
Entry #: 1560402
| Open it up Dan.
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July 14, 2006
2:13:51 PM
Entry #: 1560501
| why fix it if it isnt broke, you say the bat are not that much hotter then dont change. our league has alot of money tied up in asa bats, you said you talked to people this weekend that was a tourney, all of those people probably play tourneys where both are allowed, so they do want the change. keep our league asa dont change it for a hand full of people who play tourneys.
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| trick
July 14, 2006
2:14:47 PM
Entry #: 1560504
| Dan the last post was from me
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| Scott Walston
July 14, 2006
2:52:51 PM
Entry #: 1560570
| No-No-No ... I do not agree with the New Bat idea. The fences are the same distance as they have always been, the pitchers are the same distance from the batters. Why would you want a hotter bat , if you can not hit a homerun with the current bats then maybe its your swing! I just don't like the idea...We have been a ASA league these bats are not approved for ASA , I say stick to the rules of ASA Fall and Summer.Most people have purchased bats that they can use in the League and can not afford or do not want to purchase another bat. Come on people this league does not need this, as someone said don't fix something that's not broke!
Thanks Scott Walston
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| Scott Walston
July 14, 2006
2:55:17 PM
Entry #: 1560579
| Sorry my thumb was the wrong way ...
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July 15, 2006
6:40:57 PM
Entry #: 1561813
| I wouldn't change bats at this point. Most players have already purchased their bats for this year in hopes they last a season or two. Stick with ASA rules for league ball and let tournament players worry about blowing more money for other bats. The fences at Pyramid Park are short anyway. I'd let it be the way it is.
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July 16, 2006
7:58:36 AM
Entry #: 1562198
| how about we change the balls not the bats???
the balls this yr only benifit 2 teams!
dan just get some balls.
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July 16, 2006
9:16:57 AM
Entry #: 1562285
| we're playing softball not homerun derby.
sacraficing player safety for greater homerun potential is absurd. the best defense and most skilled hitters should determine outcome of games. not best bats.
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| bill
July 16, 2006
9:44:52 AM
Entry #: 1562302
| change the balls not the bats. we have alot invested in asa bats
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| Zach
July 16, 2006
10:51:29 PM
Entry #: 1563292
| If we were playing with 300' fences I might be for the change, but with our current fields I think the ASA bats are more than adequate. Also, I think we would have to consider uping the homerun limit as well - nothing more frustrating than hitting a ball out of the park and getting an out (stupid rule anyway, why is it not a single or something?) Also we could star hitting 47 core 525s and everybody would feel like they were hitting hotter bats as well. Bottom line is that guys that are supposed to hit homeruns are still going to hit them and a few guys that have WTP are going to hit a couple out as well...while we are talking about change, what about using the ASA stealing rule as well - it will make the catchers at least try and catch the freakin' ball!! Just a though, makes the game more exciting I think..
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| DReid
July 17, 2006
12:31:09 AM
Entry #: 1563365
| Thanks for the feedback guys and keep it coming. To let everyone know, you can see my thoughts in a post titled "2006 Leagues" from October of 2005. BUT, to play devils advocate here:
The NSA/USSSSA bats are not going to make that much of a difference. It's not like the difference between the Ultra's and a Demarini F2. The original Freak that a LOT of teams still have, is hotter than the NSA bats are. So I don't think safety is a factor. I don't know of any pitchers that have been hit in the 3 years I've been playing and the NSA bats are not much hotter than the ASA bats are.
Also, while we've always been an ASA league, we've always been alot of things that we are trying to change as well. From all of my knowledge, ASA softball is run by a lot of older guys who have no clue as to what we as softball players nowadays want.
The bats we currently have, will always be legal in our leagues. BUT, if people want to go and buy the NSA bats, then they at least have that option. The people who can hit HR's are going to be able to do that anyway. BUT, the NSA bats aren't going to turn normal guys into HR hitters like the Ultra did. They are no where near that level.
There are at least 6-8 teams in our men's league who play some weekend tournaments. Most of these tourneys are NSA/USSSA tourneys.
Homerun totals is not the reason for the option to change. I don't think it will change that much. It's about changing to fit with the times as I am starting to feel that ASA is becoming an outdated organization and we are giving all of the players more options.
As I said, the current bats will always be available so the bats everyone has now will always be legal. Harder balls are not an option because that will change safety more than any bat you can hit. You can hit an ASA bat with a 47/525 A LOT harder than you can hit an Ultra with a 44/375.
Again, I personally don't want to give my opinion because I don't feel the fields are big enough to change. BUT, I also feel that the ASA is making things harder by their bat list verses the open list that all the other organizations have.
Just my input, and I'm drunk from our weekend tourney :D
Dan
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| abney
July 17, 2006
11:32:38 AM
Entry #: 1564064
| dan, i think we need to stay with asa bat list for the church league. the fall league might be a good test for the hotter bats. maybe alright for the a division but not for the b and c division or co-ed for summer ball.
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July 19, 2006
5:23:23 PM
Entry #: 1569465
| i am one of those that play weekend tourney's and they are mostly USSSA.... i agree if someone is going to hit a HR they can do it with pretty much any bat (while hotter bats may benifit some). i dont care either way but that being said i can see an advantage to having more availability in bats....
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| Cutsinger
July 21, 2006
4:33:28 PM
Entry #: 1573482
| I'm not sure of any serious injuries over the past few years by ball hit by these bats. But I can tell you from a pitcher's perspective, I've been hit several times, and it's getting harder to find people now even willing to Pitch. I think the Bats and Balls we are currently using are just fine. I do think Commercial league is a different story though.
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July 27, 2006
8:40:35 AM
Entry #: 1583772
| I pitch in the a division and play some tourney ball and I can tell you that the bats do make a difference. When everyone signed up for this league, it was an asa league and it has been for years. The balls come alot quicker off the 100+ bats than the 98 bats. Our infields are the worst around and we have short fences. Not a good combo.
It seems like by your last entry that you have already decided to change regardless what the players think.
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| DReid
July 27, 2006
11:02:58 AM
Entry #: 1584011
| As I stated in my post, my thoughts are in a post from last October titled "2006 Leagues". Darren Lindsey asked the question about bats and I gave him my personal opinion on it. Plus, I even said that I was going to play a little devil's advocate, that's why I posted what I did.
If you know me, hopefully you do know that what the players want/think is the main determining factor in what happens in the league. I haven't decided to change anything. It doesn't matter to me if I swing a ASA or a NSA bat, you only have to get it 275' to get it out of these parks and those bats aren't going to make that difference.
I will say this again though, the Freak 100 and the Synergy 2 are hotter than any NSA/USSSA/100+ mph bat out there. I've hit my Freak 100 side by side with the Jeff Hall Mayhems, Stealth +, Freak +, etc... It hits just as hard and probably even harder than those bats do.
Chances are that bats and balls are going to stay the same as long as we play at Pyramid with the fences the same. If I'm unable to get new fields done, then I'm gonna try and get the fences moved back. At that point, we'll lengthen the bases 5 feet, put in a rule similar to ISA to where the pitcher can stand up to 5 feet behind the mound and pitch, open the bat list and hit any 44 cor ball. Like 85% of the modern softball leagues around the country.
ASA is an organization ran by older guys who are hung up on girls fast pitch and have no idea how to advance their organization. That's why NSA is taking over just about everywhere. They've changed the rules on their top tournament in the state for homeruns to where it's 4 homeruns per game. The top level ASA you can play in Illinois now, you can only hit 4 hr's per game. Talk about the middle being open.
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| TClark
July 30, 2006
4:19:46 PM
Entry #: 1589407
| I am against anything that will put our pitchers in any more danger. Like Bret said, it is getting tougher to get guys to pitch. I understand that the "hotter" balls are a greater risk than the bats, but this is a recreational league. Most guys have to get up and go to work the next morning. I do not see anything wrong with the way things are now.......
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| kevin soldner
August 5, 2006
8:47:51 PM
Entry #: 1602205
| the bats we use now are just fine we dont need anyone getting hurtwith the ussa bats. they would only help those who hit homers anyway
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