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TOPIC: embarrassing |
| TBH™
September 19, 2012
11:35:38 AM
Entry #: 3979730
| I’m a first year player in this league with many years of softball experience playing in leagues in and around the GTA including tournament play. USPL has been a fantastic experience. A well run league with an up to date web site, great guys, friendly competition and always an old friend on a team across the diamond.
I was impressed until last evening. How is any team expected after losing/lost a game going into/or in the bottom of the 7th continue such game so the winning team can pad their +/-?? This occured last evening and one umpire mentioned after the game …“that is the dumbest rule in softball history”!! A couple guys mentioned this rule has been around for as long as they can remember. Well then, the league has dropped the ball for a long time. I would not have thought a softball league rule could make Yunel Escobar’s ‘eye black decision’ look so good.
This is how people get hurt, this is how teams implode on one another, this is how conflict is created between two opponents. Imagine a team padding their +/- (in a game they already won) drills the opposing pitcher? Reading this forum I think some people would be upset with that. Brutal!! The home team in playoffs is the higher seed in the standings for a reason. Their reward is the chance to WIN the game holding the hammer. Teams should be allotted their margin of victory as it is. The +/- tie breaker will still be a good determination of who should and should not move on. Teams need to expect closer games during playoff time, this rule ruins that spirit.
Someone needs to burst the bubble surrounding everyone’s precious USPL, give their heads a shake and revise this rule. If you support this rule, don’t bother posting because you will be WRONG and nothing you can say will justify it as a good rule. It is embarrassing for the team on both sides of the ball to be standing out there in a decided game.
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| daump
September 19, 2012
2:13:30 PM
Entry #: 3979901
| Sounds like Mr. Bitter pants lost last night. Do we really have to explain why the rule is in place or you can figure it out for yourself?
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| Tarheel
September 19, 2012
4:47:02 PM
Entry #: 3980059
| TBH, speaking of bitter how would you feel if you lost a tie breaker because you had one or two less half innings to complete your plus minus? So a team should be penalized for having a better record? For someone who says they are a seasoned ball player your comments certainly don't support that! If you are so unhappy with the rule I am sure you can find a less competitive league to join!
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| TBH™
September 19, 2012
5:29:11 PM
Entry #: 3980083
| Tarheel, I'm a rational guy, I don't want to get into a whole thing...that was just my opinion and the opinion of almost everyone else on the field.
First off we WON the game LOL.
Secondly, just look to the USPL web page for league playoff tie breakers (listed below). There are other tie breakers available other than plus/minus, so why play the extra half inning of a COMPLETED GAME. It has nothing to do with the competitive nature of this or any league. If USPL enforces a fun culture that employs an 'equal sitting rule' to ensure fair play for all, then tell me how does the rule in question fit into this model?
1) Head to Head - (Only Applicable if two teams are tied and played each other in the Round Robin)
2) Plus/Minus
3) Total Runs For in all round robin games(Higher is best)
4) Total Runs Against in all round robin games(lower is best)
5) Coin Toss
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| steanersr
September 19, 2012
6:40:11 PM
Entry #: 3980125
| A clarification for me on this issue. If the home team is not up by 7 they must bat. Is the game not over once they get to the 7 as that is the highest plus they can get? Please confirm as the game should be over once that 7 plus run total has been reached.
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| TBH™
September 19, 2012
7:17:24 PM
Entry #: 3980140
| That seems to be the rule. Home team even if in the lead bats in their last inning unless already up by 7.
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| HR Leader
September 19, 2012
8:34:32 PM
Entry #: 3980192
| That awkward moment when you get home from a game late at night and look at yourself in the mirror thinking `did I really play like that?' Then you decide to get on the forum to insult the league.
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| Griffer
September 20, 2012
12:52:36 AM
Entry #: 3980289
| Is this what this website has come to, constant pedantic crying and whining? I haven’t been on in awhile due to circumstances beyond my control and haven’t even been able to get down to the ballparks as much as I would like (which is actually a blessing for my teammates). However when I finally get here all I see is crying on the website and how someone was robbed. Now if you aren’t happy with the way things are going instead of ragging about it how about you do something really unexpected and offer to kick in a bit. I know none of you have probably ever run a league so you don’t actually know what’s involved but it is a massive undertaking.
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| GS12
September 20, 2012
1:28:08 AM
Entry #: 3980299
| TBH- I don't understand how people are going to get hurt playing one extra half inning? I am pretty sure the team who lost did not implode on each other. You can disagree with a rule all you like. To come on the league site and say its "embarrassing, don’t bother posting because you will be WRONG and league has dropped the ball for a long time" is just crazy. Its such an overreaction. This is a fun, competitive league and well run league. Its not that big of a deal.
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| Blumpkin
September 20, 2012
4:07:44 AM
Entry #: 3980313
| Well written GS12.
TBH= The Ball Hater
Why would you be upset if you get to play more ball? If your +\- if less it is also a good thing. The losing team wants to ensure that no more runs are scored. The bottom of the 7th can make a difference for both teams. Which part don't you understand ? This is not advanced math. Stay home and practice 1 plus 1 equals 2.
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| Jets6400
September 20, 2012
2:44:25 PM
Entry #: 3980615
| TBH is a clown
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| Gelatin
September 21, 2012
5:10:55 AM
Entry #: 3980975
| I know you get off on being a condescending and rude, but I'll still bite. My teammates and I were once in a similar situation a few years back. We did not advance because of a plus/ minus tie breaker by two runs. In our two wins we did not bats in the last inning. Guess what, we were pissed. What would you do? The rule makes logical sense. If the umpire truly said what you quoted then he should be looking for work elsewhere.
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| johnnyboy
September 21, 2012
8:14:46 AM
Entry #: 3980996
| So TBH basically wants the tie breakers to be Head to Head, and if they did not play each other, then it should be a coin toss. Because at bats for the home team in the bottom of the 7th affect the 2nd,3rd and 4th tie breaker rules. Good one, I guess that I am "WRONG" because I responded to this. Give your head a shake and think about something before you post it.
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| TBH™
September 21, 2012
9:48:32 AM
Entry #: 3981038
| LOL, boys, boys…I sincerely apologize for being condescending and rude. Just to clarify for Johnnyboy, the tie breaker after head-to-head is runs for then runs against…it generally would not come down to a coin toss! All I’m saying is if a team finishes higher in the standings, they get home field advantage to help win the game not to tack on plus/minus against a team that has already lost. As a losing team, do you want to be standing out there trying not to lose the game by more?? Seriously, think about it. If you don't mind it then again, I apologize. If guys want to keep playing in the bottom of the 7th then why not choose home and away teams by a coin toss at the beginning of the game (like in SPN, SPO and NSN tournament play)? How many more advantages does a higher seeded team need to move onto the next round? Playoff games are generally tighter so if a team wins by 1 or by 7 then those are the breaks. If you are eliminated on plus/minus then I suggest not getting bent out of shape over the lack of an at bat in a game you already won because you did not win by enough runs Your team does not deserve to move on. I didn’t see the Yankees come out in the bottom of the 9th last night to try and tack on more runs just in case their division title comes down to runs for and against :)
Either way I’m over it and I should have been more reasonable in my first post! We all play by the same set of rules in this league so it’s all good.
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| Cads 33
September 21, 2012
12:51:59 PM
Entry #: 3981175
| What are the tie-breaker rules in the playoffs? I don't see a set of playoff rules on the website.
I assume it goes
1. Total points
2. head-to-head
3. +/-
then what???
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| johnnyboy
September 21, 2012
1:42:50 PM
Entry #: 3981196
| The rules were posted on the homepage if you scroll down.
TIE - BREAKER RULES
** In the event of a tie based on wins, here is the tiebreaker
1) Head to Head - (Only Applicable if two teams are tied and played each other in the Round Robin)
2) Plus/Minus
3) Total Runs For in all round robin games(Higher is best)
4) Total Runs Against in all round robin games(lower is best)
5) Coin Toss
At TBH, Lets say there are two teams tied after the round robin for the 6th and final spot to play on Sunday, they were opposite divisions. one team being the higher seed had one two games by a run, and were the Home team did not use their last at bat. Where the other team ended up having two extra innings. They ended up with a better plus/minus, they would be the team to go on. If we remove the plus/minus and have it go for Runs for, this team still has had two more innings where they could put up more runs. The sole intention is to try and eliminate that argument come Saturday night, if it arises. If everyone has the same amount of innings played.
I do understand that it sucks to have to go out and finish the bottom of the seventh after you have already lost. But you are playing for pride still, and a chance at keeping your runs against as low as possible.
Enjoy the weekend at the tent
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| Cads 33
September 21, 2012
2:28:26 PM
Entry #: 3981223
| johnny Boy,
Sorry... still can't see the rules posted on the home page. Maybe you can direct me.
Third tie breaker - runs for - favours the visiting teams because they are allowed 21 outs where in some cases the home team is allowed only 18 if already up by 7 runs.
True +/- run differential or runs against should be used.
perhaps next year we give the higher seeded team the opportunity to decide if they want home or visitors and drop the current "bat in the bottom of the 7th rule"
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| Cads 33
September 21, 2012
2:32:34 PM
Entry #: 3981224
| Found the rules on the Playoffs 2012 tab.
However: Tie Breaker Rule 3 still favours visiting teams who get full at bats.
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| Harry Package
September 22, 2012
10:13:59 PM
Entry #: 3981782
| Solution: Amend the tie-breaker rules regarding +/- to take into account the amount of actual innings a team plays? We know who the home team is in each game, so we know who actually batted 6 times instead of 7 based on the outcome. There's a little math that may need to get done once in a while, but we have some smart guys on the Exec. This would keep the integrity of the tie-breaker system in tact and also get the losers off the field.
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| Mellowing Out
September 23, 2012
9:09:19 PM
Entry #: 3982354
| Option being considered for next year:
Higher seed gets the choice of taking home or visitors(as if they won the coin toss in tournament play. Game ends when a winner is declared regardless of +/-.
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